[doric]

First of all, forgive me for rattling on and also I apologize to those who might take this wrong, but I need to vent about scooters.

I don't want to start the great scooter debate of 2009, but I have some things that I would like to get off my chest.

My parents(69 & 74) and I have been back about 3 weeks from WDW. My parents are in good shape get through Disney very well. I understand that some people have medical issues and aren't able to get around as well. In my rantings I don't include those people. I have seen adults & children in very serious conditions and have no problem with them using wheelchairs or scooters, or whatever else. These people have far more problems than I will ever have.

But those of us know that there are people who don't need them as much. I also understand that there maybe something else wrong with someone than just what we think might be there.

So here is my experience: my family stayed at AKL last year and we loved it. This this my mother wanted to stay at the GF. As much as I love AKL I won't stay there again until something is done about transportation. I went back to see AKL and look out at the animals. We waited at the MK stop for AKL and a scooter comes. She boarded the scooter then walked onto the bus. We boarded the bus at 5:01pm and left. The Kidani Village is new this year so we stopped there first. The bus driver had to keep moving up and back to get on the sidewalk. It took SIXTEEN minutes to get the scooter off the bus. It took us 32 minutes from the beginning to the end. We spent about 45 minutes there and walked to the MK stop. There were a lot of people waiting. Lo and behold 3 scooters showed up and guess where they were going, yup MK. The driver told them only 2 could go. The one lady even ran into the back of the other lady trying to get on the bus!!! So they they ended up taking 10 seats with the scooters and the family. We waited 22 minutes to load them on. A family next to me had gotten there before and had a dining reservation. They said they were going to be late. The bus was jammed packed and some people still had to wait for the next one. Boy were some people mad. It took us over an hour just to get to the hotel and back in traveling and waiting time.

I understand my time isn't the most valuable in the world, but soooo many people were affected by the 3 scooters. I without a doubt would have understood if I felt these people desperately needed them, but I feel they rented them not for their convience, but the inconvience of others.

I know why people rent them, it's much easier if you are older, have leg problems, or are obese. I just wish more of the scooter renters would keep in mind that exceptions are made to accomedate you, not make it all about you.

Thank you for listening to my long winded rant. Please don't take it the wrong way.

[sue299]

I do agree with you. I also am one, if a person truly needs the scooter/wheelchair, even if they have problems walking, then by all means get it so you can enjoy your trip too. I have vacationed with a friend of my husband's who is paralyzed from the waist down due to a vehicle accident. It is very sad how hard the simplest things are for these people with disabilities that we take for granted.

and yes, we are NOT talking about those people. I also agree, the ones who have 2 or 3 children hanging on the scooter while a perfectly abled person is driving. Also, I think some people get them so they do not have to wait in line, and this is not fair to the ones we cannot obviously see who should not have to wait in line - parents who know because of a medical problem their children get impatient.

I think other arrangements should be made for the scooters. I don't know what, maybe them actually waiting through the bus line ques for one. maybe some other sort of transportation to take the scooters to the parks? Disney's smart.... I'm sure they could help figure out something to make it fair to everyone.

another pet peeve of mine is an able bodied person sitting while an older person or someone holding a child is standing on the buses!

[Dana]

It is very hard to take offense to your thread. You stated your opinion and vented without being offensive in any way. I agree that there needs to be another option for scooters, but it's hard to say what will and won't work. It is time consuming for them to be loaded on to a bus etc. I agree, but it's also hard to have a "scooter" only bus and single people out and make them take a seperate bus simply because they require the use of a scooter. I honestly would have found a cab and left after 20minutes. I don't sweat the things I can't change...I make other arangements to avoid them

[ddoll]

I had no idea the scooters were causing such a time delay with the busses (since I don't use busses). If they are indeed interfering with the normal flow of guest's transport then there should be an alternate plan put in place for them. I think we can all agree, that no matter what the reason, there seems to be a larger number of scooters on property now than in years past.

Just like there is an alternate park entrance for people without bags, perhaps they can make an alternate bus for scooters? I'll bet as frustrated as guests are, the bus drivers are also frustrated with those time delays.

[nubeanie]

easy solution is to NOT allow them on the busses! while i doubt disney will change anything right now as out of all the times i've rode the busses, scooters were only and issue a couple of times. people who use scooters for the most part can walk a short distance. i don't see why most of these people can't walk from the bus to the scooter rental place, from their room to the bus stop and vice versa.

[Andrea]

My limited experience with the problem is that it boils down to this: The bus driver.

I've seen them pull that bus in, get that scooter in and everyone loaded in no time flat. (Most of their time spent telling people that NO, they can't board the bus until the scooter business is taken care of.)

And then I've seen the bus drivers who pull up. Then pull back. Then shimmy shimmy shimmy... and yeah, the process seems to take DAYS while the driver tries to get the bus close enough to the curb.

Sometimes you do get bad luck and a lot of scooters/wheelchairs want to board... and with a less skilled driver you eat up a lot of time.

So- make sure all the bus drivers are better at parallel parking?

Also- I've seen some of the buses do that cool thing where the whole side kind of collapses down a bit for easier boarding of scooter/wheelchairs. And then some don't do it when it would clearly be useful. So is that part of it, too? Do some buses do it and some don't, or is is a driver choice?

But here's my stirrin' the puddin' comment... it seems to me that the more genunine the need for the special assistance, the more discomfited the people who need help are when it takes the driver *forever* and gets to the point of inconveniencing everyone. (And I've seen the people waiting direct their annoyance at the people with the kid in the wheelchair instead of at the incompetent driver. Crazy!) The less genuine the need, the greater the entitlement mentality, and the "who cares if I'm making everybody else wait?"

[jo-jo]

There are people who need a scooter all the time and then there are people who mainly need it because of the scope of disney. My sister can walk from house to car to store etc. But she would never last from a room to bus to entrance to rides and back again. I do wish there was a rule only the scooter and one other person can go on the bus right away. I never feel annoyed at the people who need the scooter, but I do feel upset when it is a grand gathering of 27 people and they all get on the bus right away.

[hanwill]

I get more annoyed at the people who refuse to let a mom holding a little kid sit down. I have been in that situation. While I wasn't so tired that I could not stand up, my child fell asleep STANDING UP, while the other one (a 2 year old) collapsed in my arms asleep. Well, if that has happened to you- it is dead weight on your arms, and it makes it very hard to hold on going around corners, or if the driver slams on brakes. And yet, able bodied people (all-men, women, teenagers) act like they are entitled because they got there first. A little curteousness could go a long way. At least offer your seat- surely another 20 minutes on the bus is not going to kill you... And you could save a kid's life if there is an accident... It is HARD to tote kids that are sleeping...

[sue299]

Originally Posted by hanwill

I get more annoyed at the people who refuse to let a mom holding a little kid sit down. I have been in that situation. While I wasn't so tired that I could not stand up, my child fell asleep STANDING UP, while the other one (a 2 year old) collapsed in my arms asleep. Well, if that has happened to you- it is dead weight on your arms, and it makes it very hard to hold on going around corners, or if the driver slams on brakes. And yet, able bodied people (all-men, women, teenagers) act like they are entitled because they got there first. A little curteousness could go a long way. At least offer your seat- surely another 20 minutes on the bus is not going to kill you... And you could save a kid's life if there is an accident... It is HARD to tote kids that are sleeping...

I have to agree w/you on this one. I know DH and I in the beginning used to just stand if we knew it was going to be a bus w/standing people, but anymore, we take a seat if we are one of the first ones on, I try to sit where the "standing zone" really is. Then I pick who to offer my seat to. Anyone holding a child is first, then elderly or even the adult w/a child standing. You're right, the little kids don't have the balance to stand on a moving bus. It's amazing how RUDE people are. You're right, we're ALL tired. ALL our feet hurt, and we all want to get back to the room to shower and relax, but come on, lets be courteous.

[Dopey]

Originally Posted by hanwill

I get more annoyed at the people who refuse to let a mom holding a little kid sit down. I have been in that situation. While I wasn't so tired that I could not stand up, my child fell asleep STANDING UP, while the other one (a 2 year old) collapsed in my arms asleep. Well, if that has happened to you- it is dead weight on your arms, and it makes it very hard to hold on going around corners, or if the driver slams on brakes. And yet, able bodied people (all-men, women, teenagers) act like they are entitled because they got there first. A little curteousness could go a long way. At least offer your seat- surely another 20 minutes on the bus is not going to kill you... And you could save a kid's life if there is an accident... It is HARD to tote kids that are sleeping...

hear-hear!

[WishUponAStar]

I have to say that we've experienced the SAME issues with buses loading/unloading scooters. It is frustrating but I have to say that unfortunately, in about 80% of the cases we've experienced, the driver's were SO inefficient & slow about it. There needs to be some sort of efficiency training to make this run more smoothly.

When we stayed at Kidani in June we had one bus driver who attempted to 'curb' the bus 8 times... YES, we counted... 8 times because she couldn't get it right to load the scooters. Another bus driver almost HIT A GUEST waiting in line for the bus because he made a too wide turn attempting to get the bus as close to the curb as possible on the first try.

Another bus driver told everyone in the line to "please wait while he loaded a scooter. THEN, after he loaded it he didn't notice that people started boarding from the back of the bus, he didn't shut the door, so all those poor people standing where they were SUPPOSED to lost their place in line. The bus driver never even acknowledged his mistake or apologized to them.

I've seen driver after driver load assistance vehicles sooooo slowly & sloppily (not to mention their driving) that I have to wonder what training they are even required to take.

I am not going to make any judgements about people needing assistance vehicles or not BUT I will say that I agree it's starting to become a problem on the buses and the drivers I've experienced certainly aren't making the situation any better.

[bosoxx65]

It definately looks like the scooter population is Soarin' (ahem), year by year. I agree with Jess and everyone else that it boils down to the drivers getting them on snappy.

One thing that does get to me is you can be waiting patiently for 20 minutes in the sweltering heat, the bus finally comes rolling along and 4 wheelchairs come rolling up to the bus stop and you have to wait another 20 minutes. I'm not an insensitive person, but hey, you're already sitting down and i've been standing for 20 minutes

As far as full buses and standing goes. We'll pass on a crowded bus and wait for another if we're really tired and don't want to stand. If someone wants to stand that bad, they are free to go ahead of us. If we get on, get a seat and the bus does fill, i've always deferred my seat to an elderly person or female. (child carrying or not). We French are gentlemen

I really love these threads because it's nice to see i'm not the only one thinking of these things year after year.

[CleveRocks]

Originally Posted by hanwill

I get more annoyed at the people who refuse to let a mom holding a little kid sit down. I have been in that situation. While I wasn't so tired that I could not stand up, my child fell asleep STANDING UP, while the other one (a 2 year old) collapsed in my arms asleep. Well, if that has happened to you- it is dead weight on your arms, and it makes it very hard to hold on going around corners, or if the driver slams on brakes. And yet, able bodied people (all-men, women, teenagers) act like they are entitled because they got there first. A little curteousness could go a long way. At least offer your seat- surely another 20 minutes on the bus is not going to kill you... And you could save a kid's life if there is an accident... It is HARD to tote kids that are sleeping...

I will do my very very best to try to explain my views without coming off as sarcastic or negative.

Been there, done that. My first trip was with my 5 and 2.5 year olds. Then they were 6.5 and 4. And earlier this year they were almost-9 and 6. So I'm not talking from the cheap seats ... I've been there.

I should also say that as a healthy, roughly 40-year-old man, I NEVER stay seated if I believe someone else needs that seat more than I do.

I'm sure you will agree with this paragraph I'm writing now. If you get on a standing-room-only bus, and you believe your child's LIFE is in danger because you or your child are standing, then it is YOUR responsibility to not get on that bus. Are you seriously telling all of us that you will risk your child's life by hoping that someone will come to your aid? God forbid something did happen and your child did die in an accident, who would bear more responsibility ... the strangers who didn't volunteer their seats, or the parent who knowlingly placed his/her child in danger??? Please look at it from this perspective.

There were NUMEROUS times when my wife and I declined to get on a SRO bus and waited for the next bus so our kids could have seats. Yes, I'm talking after a long hot day, cranky kids falling off their feet, holding my sweaty and sleeping and getting-heavier-every-minute 4 year old in my arms, just waited in a 45 minute line after park closing, and YES, we've let people behind us go past us so that we could get our kids seats for the next bus.

If I believe my kids are truly, truly, really in danger by standing on a bus (or by being held by me while I stand), then there is no way on God's green Earth that I will risk their lives by boarding a SRO bus and hoping that someone will do the right thing.

It is MY responsibility to do what I think will keep my kids safe. Yes, from the standpoint of good manners and being a good person, those two 20-something men should get the heck out of their seats and let my 6 year old sit next to my wife holding our sleeping 4 year old, but I will NEVER place my kids in a dangerous position if I can help it.

And I can help it by not boarding a bus when I know they won't get a seat unless some stranger decides to be nice.

God forbid if something happens to my kids on that bus ride, I'd have only my wife and myself to blame, because we put our kids in that position ... those selfish 20-somethings should be ashamed of themselves for not offering up their seats, but my wife and I would have been the ones truly to blame.

[FireAngel]

Um..... WOW I just hang out at the park for an extra half hour after closing. My daughter had to use a wheelchair once because of her knee when we went to Disney and we still waited way after the park closed to get on a bus.

[Lisnoe]

My Mom had to use a scooter on her last visit to WDW (and I do mean last since she passed away 6 months after that trip). I am sorry if the able bodied visitors were inconvenienced by her visit while waiting to board a bus. I hope her poor health and wanting to spend time with her family didn't interfere with their frantic vacation plans. I find the lack of compassion and patience to be most disturbing. I only hope that someday those same people who are complaining of the inconvenience do not find themselves or someone they love having to use a scooter on their trip to WDW.

I agree that the drivers should be properly trained on how to load/unload scooters efficiently. Luckily we did not experience any difficulties when using the busses and monorails. We appreciated the patience of the other guests and the courtesy they extended to us.

On my previous trips to WDW, I have waited for scooters to exit and enter the busses and monorails. I have always found myself saying a prayer of gratitude that I was an able bodied person who could enjoy my vacation without the need of a scooter. Perhaps this attitude needs to be shared by others.